Long before he became a four-time AEW World Champion, Jon Moxley was an up-and-coming in-ring talent on the independent wrestling scene, with his start coming at the Heartland Wrestling Association (HWA) in Cincinnati, Ohio. Around the same time, Denise Winkelman (then known as Dr. Melvin Winkelman) and several others were training at the nearby Northern Wrestling Federation (NWF).
During a recent interview with WrestleZone’s Ella Jay, Winkelman recalled the NWF once invading HWA, leading to a number of cross-promotional matches and storylines, some of which involved Moxley.
“At the time, it was HWA and NWF. We didn’t hate each other, but it wasn’t like we were really tight. It was kind of WCW and WWF for that region. NWF had been in business for like 20 years. HWA had been around forever … So Moxley had been training with the HWA.
“The thing that shocked everybody was, they didn’t tell anybody because you could keep a secret back then, Roger Ruffen, [Karl Anderson], and I think it was Ryan Stone, one of the best wrestling names of all time. They showed up one night at an HWA event and they snuck in and did an started an invasion angle. So big thing at one of their shows.
Interactions with Jon Moxley
“They showed up in a couple NWF shows, so it kind of became like a big war thing and it was really well done. That led to some big 200 people in the arena, two to three hundred and they had a really great run. I think it was ’05 that they were doing this. We definitely worked with Jon Moxley,” she continued. “I didn’t personally work with him, but I remember talking to him, having conversations with him, and I couldn’t understand anything he was saying.
“He was just like mumbling. He would turn away and I was very softspoken as well, but I would look at my friends and be like, ‘What the heck did he just say to me?’ I have no idea. Then two years later, he goes to Philly, and he’s like the best talker in the world.”
In 2008, Winkelman left the professional wrestling world to pursue other creative avenues, though she later returned to it for a brief run in 2016. Nowadays, she is a comedian, with her debut special Bougie On a Budget now out across YouTube, Apple TV, Amazon Prime Videos, and other outlets.
Meanwhile, Jon Moxley remains a regular fixture in All Elite Wrestling. He is set to compete in a Light Outs Steel Cage Match at AEW x NJPW Forbidden Door alongside Claudio Castagnoli, The Young Bucks, and Gabe Kidd.
Watch our full interview with Denise Winkelman:
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